Minivan Madness Week--An Introduction
To state the obvious, minivans don't get a lot of respect from car enthusiasts. We all know what the conventional wisdom is: minivans are boring vehicles for boring people living a boring suburban lifestyle; so terminally uncool they contribute to global warming.
If you agree with any of that sentiment, we'd like the chance to change your mind. Car Lust challenges you to think outside the box as we devote this week to the box--that box on wheels known as the minivan. We'll show you some familiar vans and minivans, some not-so-familiar ones, and even take a look at some minivan ancestors and minivans that never were.
The truth is, the 21st-century minivan is a remarkable instrument. Insanely practical, with a utility envelope that can hold a whole youth-league soccer team or enough plywood to build a pretty serious model train layout, the modern minivan also has shockingly good driving dynamics. In one now-famous test conducted by Grassroots Motorsports magazine, a box-stock, straight-outta-Lincoln-Alabama base-model Honda Odyssey ran dead even with the legendary Porsche 356 on an autocross course--and flat-out blew the doors off an E-type Jaguar! And that was on cheap all-season radials.
Is that enough to make the minivan an object of Car Lust? Well, as they say in the car commercials, "your mileage may vary"--but we think there is no question that the minivan is more than deserving of your respect.
Respect the van.
--Cookie the Dog's Owner
Sean on May 03, 2010 at 01:10 PM
Everybody thinks they're too cool for a minivan yet I haven't met the person who truly was. The minivan has huge advantages, everyone hates them so their cheap used, they carry all kinds of crap, they can tow a small trailer for even more crap and they take the brunt of the everyday duties while your sports car waits in the garage for the next sunny day. If they only came with stick shifts they’d be good enough to merry.
...m... on May 03, 2010 at 04:30 PM
...cool!..
Owen on May 03, 2010 at 04:33 PM
Lots of good opportunities here. I hope you've got something planned on the Greenbrier.
tigerstrypes on May 03, 2010 at 06:27 PM
I was raised with 2 generations of Mopar minivans: a '94 and '00 model, both Sport and short wheelbase models, so they never looked all that bad. It wasn't too long ago that they earned my respect. I'll share my experiences with 'em when the time and topic is right.
Hope you mention the Turbo Dodge minivans!
M. Thompson on May 03, 2010 at 07:58 PM
I drove the old '93 Nissan Quest to school as a kid. Plenty of space to move crud to school, and had a 6 to keep up on the highways.
Only problem was a window breaking in a snow storm in the parking lot.
David Colborne on May 03, 2010 at 09:02 PM
Minivans may or may not be cool - that is arguable. What is not arguable is that they are incredibly practical and versatile. Call it lust, call it respect, they're still pretty amazing.
Kevin on May 03, 2010 at 11:50 PM
I'll always respect the minivan owner/driver infinitely more than the SUV owner/driver. The minivan was a logical and practical extension of the station wagon concept, and the price paid in mileage was negligible while the practicality factor went up significantly. Contrast that with the SUV, which simply exists to bolster the ego and self-worth of the perpetually insecure and/or apathetic overweight American boob. Same thing for most large trucks...99% of them are owned and driven 99% of the time with no payload or passengers, just because the rednecks need to comply with their peers. Back in the 60's and 70's this simply was not the case. I tip my hat to the American builder or farmer or plumber or whatever the case may be who actually uses their truck regularly as a truck....and maybe to the SUV owner who takes it 4-wheeling on a regular basis...(maybe one in a million or so) but the rest of you are poseurs who only buy what is trendy just so you can fit in(and maybe so you can feel safer. What a joke.).
Minivan owners, on the other hand, need no such ego-boosters. They don't need their vehicles to validate themselves; they need the utility and not all of the BS. Personally I don't like how a lot of the minivans handle but nobody can fault them for their sheer utility. I salute you, minivan owners!
Steaming Pile on May 04, 2010 at 09:17 AM
Well, Kevin, there are tradeoffs when driving a van, handling being one of them. The whole concept of a minivan was to minimize those tradeoffs. Pity that most minivans nowadays have grown so fat they no longer deserve to be called "mini." The first generation Chrysler minivans weighed around 3300 lbs. The current generation weighs 4300.
John Surratt on May 04, 2010 at 12:22 PM
My first vehicle was a 1965 VW micro bus with 21 windows and a canvas sun roof. IMHO the first mini van. It was way to much fun and unfortunately died of rust. It took me awhile to come back but the Plymouth Grand Voyager and Dodge Grand Caravan have been my favorite vehicles for 20 years. My current 2007 still is rated at 27mpg which compares favorably to a lot of smaller cars. The stow and go seats are great and the closest thing to real transformer toy.
Dustin on May 04, 2010 at 12:34 PM
Kevin, you are far too concerned wtih psychoanalyzing what other people are doing and announcing who you have judged. Do you really think your judgment is something we all need to hear?
My truck gets 20 miles per gallon. It's pretty big, an F-150, but it gets great mileage when compared to most cars. I need a truck sometimes. I can't replace my truck with a Prius when I don't need the payload, so I still use the truck to get groceries or get to work, and every now and then, I notice someone giving me a dirty look from their Subaru (that gets worse mileage, LOL).
The most expensive and environmentally costly aspect of a vehicle is its construction, so having a single truck that handles all my needs is the right move for me. I don't really know why that matters so much to you that I'm in a big truck. Indeed, most SUVs are less practical, but again, style and enjoyment matter to people. If someone occasionally needs to haul a trailer or drive offroad, or just likes SUVs, that's their business. Minivans seem to be better vehicles for almost any purpose I can think of, but so what? People have earrings and purses and pretty shoes, and I don't begrudge them that freedom.
Some even have fancy sports cars that are simply not practical. Leave others alone. Car choice is absolutely not a problem for the planet or society. You only live once, so drive something you love, and ignore the Kevins.
Redman on May 04, 2010 at 12:36 PM
I drive a 2000 Quest with almost 200,000 miles. I'm still on the original brakes.
Stick on May 04, 2010 at 12:45 PM
I heard a comedian once who said it completely impossible for an American male to appear cool in a minivan; that when you buy one, they strip you down, hose you off, and throw you out of coolville.
67SSConvertible on May 04, 2010 at 12:46 PM
Swagger Wagon. I can and do anything and everything in mine.
David Colborne on May 04, 2010 at 12:58 PM
Ah, the classic SUV/big truck rant... fortunately, it's so "classic" that there's a policy in place here, along with a rather lengthy "SUV Throwdown", that politely discourages such polemics:
http://www.carlustblog.com/2008/04/suv-fracas
I will note that "freedom" isn't freedom when you're only allowed to do what you "need", nor is it freedom when you're only allowed to do what somebody else thinks is "smart" or "wise". You have to take the bad with the good - if you want the freedom to do what you want, you have to put up with the fact that others are free to do what they want, even if you disagree with it. Sometimes that means buying seemingly unnecessary large trucks or SUVs. Sometimes that means buying ridiculously small cars that look like they'll accordion on anybody in them if they hit anything more substantial than a slight breeze. In the end, it's their money, their choice, and I wouldn't have it any other way.
Having said all that, for straight-up city passenger hauling, minivans are infinitely better than all but the most minivan-like SUVs. There's a reason "Crossover Utes" look so much like minivans with slightly raised suspensions - it's because the minivan form factor works and it works well. Since the image of the SUV has taken such a hit as of late, though, I have a sneaking suspicion that minivan sales might just rise in the near future, though manufacturers might have to call them "Xtreme Utility Vehicles" or something equally noxious to cover up the stench the "minivan" moniker racked up over a decade ago.
Bryan on May 04, 2010 at 01:03 PM
I had a Ford Windstar for about 6 years, terrific car, there was a transmission issue once but it was under warranty. We thought we were upgrading with a Chevy Uplander, but that is just a poseur suv and isn't particularly good as an suv or a minivan. I'd like my Windstar back, please.
NDanger on May 04, 2010 at 01:07 PM
No one here is commenting on the obvious benefits of a spacious back seat area and privacy glass!!!
Poole on May 04, 2010 at 01:41 PM
My family only owned vans from 1963 through 2006.
I still have fond memories of the first - a 1963 Chevrolet Greenbriar. Slow. Ugly. Fire engine red. No A/C so hot in the summer. All metal dashboard. Built like a tank. One night, an Olds Cutlass in the left lane attempted to make a right turn across the lane we were occupying. The Olds' passenger door was caved in. The Greenbriar had a small dent below the left headlight - which was not broken.
Never got a chance to drive it. Dad traded it in on a 1970 VW van
Heather B on May 04, 2010 at 01:45 PM
I drive a 99 extended-length Montana. It has been a workhorse for me. Plywood? 8 x 4 flat in the back. Kids? Seating for 7. Comfort? Pretty good. The only thing tempting me about an SUV is the greater separation between kids and being able to put more stuff and both 70-lb dogs in it for longer trips.
Dark Helmet on May 04, 2010 at 01:51 PM
I've owned an Odyssey (great vehicle) and currently have a CR-V, a Pilot and a Nissan Frontier. All trucks. All four wheel drive. None purchased in order to boost ego. The Pilot, for example, seats eight -- more than my old Odyssey. When you have five kids that's very helpful. It can also pull a boat. Very helpful when you have three boats. It also climbs through almost any depth of snow -- very helpful when you live in Wisconsin. Does well on muddy slopes -- nice when you camping in a cow pasture in southern Ohio. The Odyssey was great, but it couldn't do all that. So let us praise the minivan, but let us not dis the SUV.
Ralph Kinney Bennett on May 04, 2010 at 02:26 PM
POSSIBILITY, PREROGATIVE, POTENTIAL! Kevin needs to calm down and lose that snide class voyeurism. We love vans and we love trucks and we love SUVs, not just for their versatility but for their POSSIBILITY. We are Americans and we like room and if we drive them six months empty and only one day with an antique desk or Mom's new stove or some plywood in the back, well, that's our PREROGATIVE. We like to have POTENTIAL in our vehicles, even if we don't always use it. (We love little cars, too; sort of, but they just don't have all that possibility and potential.)
Joe on May 04, 2010 at 03:54 PM
My 2001 Odyssey is the best car I have owned and close to the best car I have driven. My only complaint is that it doesn't automatically adjust the driver seat for different drivers like the most recent models.
What amazes me is how much it can carry. I can drop the rear seats and put in a full 8x4 sheet of plywood. The two shining moments were when a Tacoma owning friend borrowed it to carry a family heirloom mirror/dresser and when my sister-in-law borrowed it to haul something since the item was too tall to fit in their Ford Excursion! (She'd sworn mini-vans sucked and after driving it said she was almost persuaded to buy one--after much teasing she sheepishly admitted that it handled much better than her Ford, which actually is rather nice, but just couldn't bring herself to get a mini-van.)
Hucbald on May 04, 2010 at 04:15 PM
I don't care. If I ever start talking about a minivan, somebody do an intervention. What I want is a 150/1500 class pickup with a light duty diesel that gets 30 MPG, not a vehicle with the associated stigma of a minivan: The only balls in those are of the soccer and basket variety.
T.J. on May 04, 2010 at 04:16 PM
Dark Helmet: I don't know what model year your Odyssey was, but for what it's worth, my Odyssey seats eight (with a more comfortable back seat than my neighbor's Pilot), can tow a decent amount, and has handled lots of snow in Wisconsin.
Dandapani on May 04, 2010 at 06:38 PM
Rented a new Toyota Sienna minivan this summer to haul some of my adult sons around here in FL. Been 20 years since I drove a minivan, the last one being a Ford Aerostar. I was very impressed with the handling, power, and amenities offered in the new minivans. Nice.
Sean on May 04, 2010 at 07:19 PM
When living in NYC I didn't own a car but always rented a minivan when I required a vehicle. I'm a car guy but don't have any prejudices against them (as I appreciate their superb utility). Those who think they can't be fun should check out the Mercedes R63 - it'd likely leave anything 'sporty' they are driving in the dust!