Round Table--Pontiac Post-Mortem
I'm sure you've all noticed that what was meant to be a week-long tribute to Pontiac following the news of its demise has turned into something much longer and more drawn-out than intended. So, as our grand finale wrapping up the topic, we've all put together our thoughts on the passing of Pontiac.
My own experience is limited, although I have always rather favored the brand. The first car I remember as a child was my parents' maroon 2-door Catalina. I vaguely remember taking trips in it down to Alabama from Wisconsin during the summer. We'd leave at like 4 a.m. and drive all day to get there. I think that was the car I crawled into as a young lad and removed the parking brake and let the damn thing roll backwards down the driveway. I still have nightmares in which I am trying to mash down brake pedals on cars trying to get them to stop. There's at least one driving around Seattle (parked, actually, I don't know if I've ever seen it moving) and I have visions of getting into it and applying the brakes to a full stop just as a cathartic way to assuage the terrors of my youth.
The funny thing about my parents and the Catalina is that they never owned another Pontiac again (though they kept buying GM products), but that was the only car they ever talked about. They would always say, "Remember that old Pontiac we had? What a great car that was."
I always preferred the Trans Am and Firebird to the Camaro myself. That probably started with the Bandit edition because I really loved the way that car looked. It always seemed a bit more younger/sportier and maybe a bit more upscale than the Camaro, though this may be projection on my part ("*I* like it, so it must be more sophisticated"). And I remember liking the whole "Wide Track" ad campaign. To be honest, that was about the only generation I really liked of the T/A. The follow-on seemed a bit too contrived to me, and the earlier versions just lacked any real styling. Give me a black '76 with that enormous, ridiculous screaming chicken, and I would never need another car.
Come to think of it, I also have a fetish for the '76-ish Grand Prix--it's a gorgeous car. It seemed like the epitome of that sort of Stutz design some like to ridicule. Okay, that makes two Pontiacs--give me a maroon '76 Grand Prix, with maybe some engine upgrades, and I would never need another another car.
What's really too bad is that Pontiacs were just starting to get interesting again. (As Henry Jones Sr. quipped, "You left just when you were becoming interesting"). I have been drooling over the G8 ... it's a wicked car, even though it's a Holden. It's too bad the new GTO wasn't thought out a bit more, because that was truly a spectacular car at the price.
I didn't much mourn AMC's passing, or Plymouth's, but I will pause a bit this evening and raise a glass of ... well, Diet Pepsi and pretend it's champagne ... and toast the only GM brand I ever really identified with.
Nathan of Brainfertilizer Fame:
Once consolidation of resources hit, GM never figured out a coherent approach to brand identification. Pontiac used to be "We build [driving?] excitement!" but it seems to have lost their way with that, especially since over the last decade or so, GM seemed to put all its sizzle into Cadillac. Of course, the best driving excitement had to go into the Corvette.
I have felt for some time that Toyota has focused on its Lexus brand while Toyota was the watered-down version. On the other hand, Honda took the opposite approach--its effort went into the Accord and Civic, while Acura took those products and added technology. Mazda has identified itself as being about "zoom zoom" for at least 15 years; it has recognizably different versions of shared Ford platforms as a result. After losing its way, Nissan regained its purpose by combining performance with quality and building world-class sport-luxury vehicles for Infiniti with cheaper versions of those vehicles for Nissan.
Clearly, a real brand identity and strategy ar e important; with that in mind, here's what I think GM should have done:
1) GMC should have been killed off. There's no reason for GMC; GMC trucks aren't different enough from Chevy trucks.
2) Cadillac should take on Mercedes-Benz, with an emphasis on class, comfort, and power.
3) Buick should take on Lexus, with an emphasis on modern luxury glitz, a touch of sports performance, and decent gas mileage.
4) Pontiac needed to take on BMW. If need be, make the Corvette a Pontiac if necessary. Every vehicle should be tuned for handling and acceleration.
5) Saturn should be focused on quirky, green, front-wheel-drive cars, competing with cars such as the Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, Toyota Prius, and Volkswagen Beetle.
6) Chevrolet should exclusively build baseline cars, inexpensive, with good quality, and excellent gas mileage. Chevrolet should compete with Kias and work to hook young drivers and families on GM products.
Customers shouldn't be confused about what a brand stands for or what they should expect; with more focused brand personalities, the same vehicle platforms could be developed, tweaked, and styled for different customer bases. Toyota/Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Honda/Acura, Ford/Mazda, and Volkswagen/Audi are all examples of what different results an automaker can achieve with the same platform.
I think this would have saved GM a great deal of trouble and would have saved Pontiac ... had GM started a decade ago when it was cash-rich from SUV sales.
Regarding Pontiac ... good riddance. Pontiac has the G8, which is cool, and the Solstice--cool from
far, but far from cool. Other than that, garbage. I rented a G6 a while back; what an awful car. It was awful to see out of, had awful handling, and while the interior was made from decent materials, it was absolutely horribly arranged. You couldn't even shut the door with the door handle; you had to grab the
map pocket. What a piece of crap.
I always wanted Pontiac to provide affordable performance, but generally it was just affordable plastic body cladding.
The first car I drove was a '67 Pontiac LeMans with a vinyl roof and an automatic. It had the base engine, and wasn't particularly fast. The fore-and-aft weight distribution was not what it should have been, and
that made it tail-happy in rain and snow. (I learned to counter-steer real fast!) It also had a disturbing tendency to suffer "engineering casualties" at inopportune moments. The only other Pontiacs we had
were an early-1970s Bonneville (nicknamed the "Bonehead") and a Catalina--neither of which made any lasting positive impression on me.
I remember GTOs and such from when I was smaller, but by the time I was driving, Pontiacs were just badge-engineered mediocrities with zero personality. When the Fiero was coming out, I wanted it to
succeed--the world can never have too many hot little sports cars. One of the buff books (I think it was C&D) reported that it was going to have a twin-turbo V-6, a fully-independent suspension, Recaro seats,
and various other goodies. When it came out, it had the woeful Iron Duke, and couldn't pull the skin off a pudding, much less keep up with a Rabbit or CRX. Word on the street was that GM's senior execs ordered it detuned so it wouldn't threaten the exalted status of the Corvette as the greatest sports car in the world. So much for the whole "We build excitement!" thing! The Fiero's one genuine engineering
advancement, the body built from a combination of a steel spaceframe and composite outer panels, got used on the "dustbuster" minivans and early Saturns--and was then promptly forgotten.
Sadly, the demise of Pontiac is anything but a surprise. For the last 30 years, GM has been building some good cars, but also some very undesirable ones. All of the big car magazines have been clear for years why GM is failing; customers have walked out because of poor quality and dealers' attitudes, never to return; market share has steadily fallen; at the Detroit Auto Show, UAW workers stand outside and picket, refusing to budge an inch; and GM refuses to listen to anybody outside the boardroom door.
Another example of GM "unawareness" is its latest campaign to sell cars, making your payments if you lose your job right after buying one of their beauties. Did they say anything about building a better car to take to your next job interview? That fresh, better designs are right around the corner? No. One of the first things I learned in Nissan management was to look at least 20 years ahead, not 90 days as Detroit does. This payments strategy is Exhibit A.
Then GM banks its future on cars like the Chevy Volt and Spark. Good luck selling a technologically unproven Volt for twice the price of a Civic. And the Spark is ugly, hideous, even frightening.
GM only cares about the short-term, and that is its downfall. Being able to make any vehicle at any time, depending on market trend, is the key to success in the auto industry. Oh, and they have to be good vehicles too.
My heart was hardened to GM, and Pontiac in particular, during a childhood competition with my best friend Mike Corsino. Mike was wildly devoted to Pontiac, and in particular the 1970 LeMans. He claimed it was the best car in the world. His devotion to the car was so over the top and irrational that it forced me into a position of opposition, a position I've never been able give up. It's a fox hole mentality that I thought would probably follow me to my grave, but it appears that Pontiac will reach the grave before I do.
That said, like Cookie the Dog's Owner, I really wanted the Fiero to succeed. But the thing about GM and probably one of the biggest reasons it has failed so completely is that one way or the other it always disappointed those who were rooting for it. Never taking a strong stand, never going all the way, is a great way to insure failure. The Fiero could have been a top-notch car, and in the right hands it would have been. I'm from the Northeast, where everything rusts; given that, the idea of a plastic car was a dream. The idea of a mid-engine sports car was even better. But we all know how that equation went--the car was disappointing.
Whether it was design, performance, or quality, GM just has not listened. GM is an entrenched bureaucracy that paternalistically decided what people should be content with, and what was good enough, based on planned obsolescence and turnover.
I took driver's ed in a '67 Tempest sedan, and despite having bought and sold 50-odd cars since then, that '67 represents my alpha-to-omega personal experience with the marque. I was never a street racer, so the go-fast models left me cold, and the cushier models weren't cushy enough.
Now, when I make a fantasy list of cars I'd like to have in my own version of Jay Leno's garage, only two Pontiacs make the cut: the 1958 Bonneville convertible and 1963 Grand Prix. I can respect the original GTO for its impact on the industry, and the Firebird for helping the gold chain industry to stay afloat in the 1970s, but beyond that...
So, so long Pontiac. You'll be missed by a lot of people, but I'm not one of them.
My personal experience with Pontiac, like many people in my age bracket, is strictly as a mild afterthought. My parents had a T1000 that may or may not have been a poorly built car; thanks to some borderline criminal dealer support, we'll never know. After that, they both swore off of GM, a position which they intend to keep to their deathbeds. Past that, a friend of mine currently drives a late '90s Grand Prix and, though it's not a bad car, it also hasn't aged particularly well. The power windows stopped
working years ago, the interior is falling apart, and, even though it only has 110,000 miles on it, my friend is afraid to take it on long trips owing to a series of infrequent but far too expensive issues that the car has developed through the years. His personal favorite was when the computer died, necessitating a $1000+ repair.
Unfortunately, Pontiac just hasn't made anything in my adult lifetime that's ever interested me in the slightest. In many respects, when I thought of them at all, I just sort of viewed them as synonymous with Buick, only slightly sportier.
I have a general liking for Pontiacs. My parents had a 1977 or 1978 Ventura that I'll hopefully find time to write about. It was a vanilla workhorse that fit our family well for that season. My godfather is a Pontiac man and has had a handful of LeMans and Bonnevilles; I've seen many of those cars in his garage since the mid-70's. The unfortunate reality is that there weren't a ton of Pontiacs that made you excited, and in recent years they have just been rebadged Chevys. I had great hope for the G8, and from a pure power standpoint it is a cool car; but I think they didn't make that all it could have been either. Pontiac always seemed like it wanted to reach for the stars, but it then settled for low orbit before burning up on re-entry. It always seemed like the brand was notable mostly for what could have been.
Rob:
I'd like to point out that in all of these comments, written by people who generally enjoy awful cars, not one has been very positive about Pontiac. That's fairly telling.
Like you, Chris, I think I always liked the idea of Pontiac more than the reality--that is, if that's a fair way to characterize your comment) The idea of a performance brand within GM is a great one; it's certainly a much clearer definition than the three murky degrees of luxury encompassed by Oldsmobile, Buick, and Cadillac. The problem is that Pontiac only rarely lived up to the idea of a performance brand. Pontiac was usually more a performance brand in theory, not in reality. Not all Pontiacs had a performance personality, and performance wasn't unique to Pontiac within the GM family. Performance just wasn't a great Pontiac differentiator.
For one thing, as David Colborne astutely pointed out in the Aztek piece, GM was too focused on maintaining a complete product lineup for each division, which assured both relentless duplication and diluted brand image. Sure, Pontiac had a few performance-oriented models since the 1960s--most prominently the GTO, Firebird/Trans Am, Fiero, and Solstice--but its performance image was diluted by the necessity to carry economy cars (the T1000), small family cars (Phoenix, J2000, Sunbird, Sunfire), a personal luxury coupe (Grand Prix), large sedans (Bonneville, Parisienne), and vans (Trans Sport, Montana). Some of these were quick and satisying, but most were pretty ordinary.
And while Pontiac had some high-profile performance cars, it wasn't appreciably special in the GM lineup. In the 1960s/1970s performance heyday, Buick had the GS series, Oldsmobile had the Rockets and 4-4-2, and Cadillac had 500-cube engines. In the 1980s Buick and GMC were making performance waves with turbo V-6s and Olsmobile had the Quad 4. In the 1990s, Cadillac and Olsmobile had the Northstar and Aurora V-8s. Only recently, with the Solstice and G8, has Pontiac taken anything approaching a performance leadership position among GM's secondary brands. Pontiac even had to share the Solstice with Saturn.
This is all ignoring Chevrolet, which, honestly, single-handedly undermined Pontiac's supposed performance leadership role. Let's say we redefined Pontiac to only produce performance cars; either stand-alone performance cars like the Fiero or Solstice, or hot-rodded versions of normal GM cars (i.e. the GTI to Chevy's Rabbit). Even so, it's hard to reserve this space for Pontiac. Chevy has always owned GM performance primacy with the Corvette, and the Camaro is a better-known version of the Trans Am. And if Pontiac's role is relegated to hot-rodding Chevrolets, well, that's what Chevy's famous SS line is for. It's difficult to come up with an ideal-case Pontiac lineup that includes more than, say, the Solstice, a GTO, and the G8. It's unfortunate that Pontiac's demise comes just as the product line was beginning to improve.
I will miss Pontiac. It brought us some entertaining models--the Fiero, the GTO, the Trans Am, the supercharged Bonnevilles, the Quad 4 Grand Am, the Solstice, and the G8--and it's always sad to lose a long-time brand name. Many, many people have driven and loved Pontiacs over the past seven decades, and while it's tempting to celebrate GM's come-uppance here, I can't draw any satisfaction from it.
My first experience with Pontiac was when I was 4 and we lived in an upstairs flat not far from the GM building. One day my mother told me to watch for my father to come home. Soon a brand new 1938 Pontiac came down the street ,and as he pulled into the driveway he waved to me. It was a maroon four-door with a straight 8. Not too long after that, when we had moved to N.Y., my father decided he would never have a red car, again as red was the worst color for paint deterioration. He also wanted a car with a heater that worked. He had been chief designer of the Pontiac studio for two years and finally traded in our '34 Ford coupe that he loved. In late '37 it was on to Studebaker.
I have liked the looks of a few Pontiacs since, including the first Firebirds, the Grand Prix, the Fiero, and the Solstice.
If GM survives, it will probably reintroduce the Pontiac name at some time in the near future.
Anthony Cagle on May 19, 2009 at 11:26 AM
Y'know, after reading all of these comments again, I've come to realize that Pontiac really was the superfluous brand. OTOH, I don't much see the point of Buick either, seems like just a somewhat crappier Cadillac. I can see Nathan's idea of pitting the various divisions against other makes, but I tend to think maintaining that many very different lines would be prohibitively expensive.
I'll readily admit that my sadness for the passing of the Wide Track is almost purely sentimental. I identified with Pontiac far more than the other GM brands and I must have succumbed to the marketing of Pontiac as more performance- and youth-oriented even when it pretty much wasn't. Maybe that's my dad talking again (he really liked Pontiacs).
I hope the Solstice, G8, and the recent GTO stay around or come back in some form or other.
ERIC D on May 19, 2009 at 12:41 PM
im starting to strongly dislike corvette
Nathan of Brainfertilizer Fame on May 19, 2009 at 01:51 PM
Buick probably won't be killed because it is considered a premium brand in China...as good or better than Lexus.
And, heck, it does seem like even with everything else in the GM line being too similar, Buick's LaCrosse and Lucerne really seemed to stand out on their own a little bit more.
And the Enclave was a significant achievement in on-road (crossover) SUVs...it now has been grabbed by Chevy and pushed as the "Traverse" as a strong competitor to the Honda Pilot.
So it seems Buick has some freedom to develop their own, differing versions of vehicles based on the corporation-supplied frame and wheelbase (...and engine?).
If my impression is actually valid and not a misunderstanding, then Buick does have some significant value as one GM brand with enough autonomy to not get dragged down by the rest of GM's uninspiring offerings.
Darrencardinal on May 19, 2009 at 07:03 PM
I can't much mourn the passing of Pontiac. I have previously written about my experience with my '82 Firebird that was such a POS.
OTOH, my mom had a 1975 Catalina that was alright. It was fire engine red, had good power and was pretty roomy. We liked that car.
But really, if you like Pontiac you will be able to get the same car rebadged as another gm car. If you liked the Firebird you can get a Camaro, the small car is the same as an Aveo, and so on.
RIP Pontiac.
dwight on May 20, 2009 at 04:07 AM
Pontiac might have survived if GM had branded it as a the division with a European flair. Pontiac failed since it had no identity; no distinguishing "features"; no "There" there.
Nathan of Brainfertilizer Fame on May 20, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Yeah, that's the problem with GM's cost-cutting moves.
They didn't differentiate the cars enough.
The same engine can be tweaked for top end power, or economy, or smoothness.
The same suspension system can be tweaked for comfort or for tautness.
GM should have allowed (forced?) each of its divisions to differentiate more with similar cars. Mazda tweaked the Tribute for more ZoomZoom, and that made it different from the Escape, so they no longer competed directly against each other. They occupied somewhat-overlapping but still significantly different ranges of customers based on substantive differences, not stylistic differences.
But Pontiac never seemed to have more than stylistic differences with its Chevy brethren.
As a result, for all the different car names GM put out, their actual number of competitive niches was quite narrow.
Top-down decisions stifled creativity at lower levels. GM should have freed the lower Division Chiefs to pursue separate identities based on substantive differences.
That Car Guy on May 20, 2009 at 01:06 PM
Darrencardinal says: "But really, if you like Pontiac you will be able to get the same car rebadged as another gm car". You know, truer words were never spoken. The Solstice is the Sky (Which is better looking, IMO), the G8 is a Holden, the G6 is essentially a Malibu, the G5 is the Cobalt, the G3 is the Aveo, and so on.
Maybe Pontiac is not dead. Maybe it's in a black Mark IV Photon Torpedo tube down on the Genesis Planet waiting to be reopened under another name. Hopefully, some of the remaining GM Divisions will "Live Long & Prosper".
rdasher on May 20, 2009 at 04:07 PM
Never owned a Pontiac - I think my dad had one back in the 40's. I had a former brother in-law who had a Fiero. We couldn't use it to go golfing. Only one set of clubs would fit in the trunk space. It wasn't good for much more than one person or two with no stuff to tote around. He didn't keep it long. I haven't seen one in many years.
Greeting on May 20, 2009 at 04:33 PM
Glad to see Pontiac gone. Check out where the name comes from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac%27s_Rebellion
kevIN on May 20, 2009 at 05:22 PM
The first car I ever bought was at the tender age of 17 - it was a 1968 Firebird with rusted out rear quarters and a non-original engine. But still I was on top of the world. I still have fond memories of that car but I haven't had the urge to buy another Pontiac. When muscle car fever bit me again I went with Chevrolet since parts were cheaper and there was a wider range of performance parts for the home mechanic.
Bilgeman on May 20, 2009 at 06:10 PM
My first sled was a gold 1976 Grand Prix SJ, one of the true "Pimpmobile" platforms, and it was a righteous long-distance highway cruiser, comfortable and reasonably fast, but it suffered the common fate of the 400 cubic inch shortblock...blew the timing chain.
This was the reputed weak point for this particular plant, and the fact that it was bad enough to gain that reputation is prima facie evidence that GM's management and/or Pontiac's engineering department either weren't doing their jobs, or just didn't care about their customers.
So ole "Huggy-Bear" is sitting out in a desert junkyard where i had it towed and abandoned, and Pontiac is likewise being kicked to the curb.
But why GM kept Buick is still a headscratcher...
Think_Logically on May 20, 2009 at 06:42 PM
I have fond memories from "the excitement people" - Firebird (any generation), Bonneville convertible, Fiero, '77 Can Am, '72 Lemans, Safari station wagon, even the oh-so-close-but-no-cigar 6000 STE - but face it, for at least ten years the brand has been redundant.
The demise of the US auto industry started with the mandated 55 MPH national speed limit. American cars could cruise all day at 90 MPH on the highway. Japanese cars would wear you out. The drop in speed removed much of the difference and led to lazy (crappy) quality in the Big Four. Would the Vega or Pinto have ever been produced if the national speed limit was 75 MPH? CAFE standards, emission controls, and safety requirements doomed the best qualities of American iron.
Factor in GM completely embraced badge engineering and the fate of Oldsmobile & Pontiac were sealed. Anyone remember the scandal of Chevy engines in Oldsmobile? Yes there really was a difference in engines. The original Firebird/Camaro F-body had a lot of mechanical differences but like most GM products it evolved to a cookie cutter product with a different plastic nose & tail. Its like adding food coloring to sugar cookies, they look different but still taste the same. What was the point to pay more for a Pontiac when you could literally get the same car for less at the Chevy dealer?
(and in response to GMC trucks - that was a move by GM to sell Chevy trucks at non-Chevy GM dealerships. They should have just sold them as Chevy Trucks)
CJinSD on May 20, 2009 at 07:06 PM
Think_Logically,
I have some bad news for your theory. The national speed limit was introduced in 1974, a few years after the Vega and Pinto(both '71 model years cars introduced in 1970). The 1973 'fuel crisis' was the driving force for reduced speed limits.
Jim on May 20, 2009 at 10:17 PM
Do any of you have any appreciation of the value of one Virgil Exner, Jr. contributing to this site? Thank you sir, for the history and insight.
Now then. Two Pontiacs in my life. My late Mom's car, a '67 Catalina fastback coupe. 400 cid, and stone reliable till her deminse (and my brother's subsequent trashing of the car) 121k + miles later in '78. First car I routinely drove on my (then) new license, and still a benchmark of smooth power, fine build quality, iffy brakes and random suspension.
The second was my 1st wife's Sunbird. Iron Duke, 4 on the floor, dealer-installed AC, and was just ........slow.
Still, it ran fine like forever, and once shod with decent (fat) Kelly Springfield radials vs. the factory bias ply bicycle tires, actually handled decently enough for it's era.
And in the heyday of the gawdawful 55 limit, we logged (diligently and meticulously) an honest 39-point-something mpg from San Antonio to Orlando, FL while confined to and observing that dreadful barrier to rapid transit.
The car was crap, but it was durable crap, which is more than can be said of much of Pontiac's subsequent offerings.
I'd love to have that Catalina in my garage.
Jim
Sunk New Dawn
Galveston, TX
Tex Lovera on May 21, 2009 at 05:16 AM
My family actually owned several Pontiacs during my childhood in Texas: '62(?) white station wagon with a red interioir (Catalina?); a '67 or so Grand Safari wagon; a '68 Firebird; and a '71 Ventura that my Mom had for 34 years (although it was pretty rotted at the end of that time). So I should have a natural liking of the brand.
But that went by the boards years ago, as did my loyalty to American cars. I have a Mazda 6 and a Honda Odyssey, and they are both absolutley wonderful. The Ford, GMs and Chryslers we've owned are crap by comparison.
A couple of things mantioned by the Car Lust guys struck me. They almost all mentioned the bureaucratic nightmare that is GM, detuning or killing off potentially cool Pontiacs to "protect" their other brands for purely political purposes. Chuck Lynch mentioned the 20-year vision of Nissan vs. the 90-day vision of GM. Does anybody here really think that turning over control of GM (or Chrysler) to the Federal Government, the unquestioned masters of the short-sighted and political, will result in anything BETTER??
So long, Pontiac. The rest of GM will surely follow you soon. I look forward to see what fills the voids you leave...
Tommy's Dad on May 21, 2009 at 09:52 AM
My one and only experience with Pontiac was a very brief flirtation with the possibility of replacing my '06 Subaru Legacy with an '06 (I think) Grand Prix- we were fighting through a bit of a financial crisis and needs lower monthly payments.
The Grand Prix wasn't bad, per se, but during the test drive there were all these things that kept popping up, little Signs and Portents like the chorus of a Greek Tragedy, just offstage whispering hints of impending doom about that Grand Prix. Hitting my head (twice) on the low top of the door frame getting in and out of the back seat. The acres of plastic buttons on the front console. Red-lit gauges and stereo controls that screamed "HIGH TECH IN THE 80s!". Indifferent handling, decent but hardly inspired acceleration, crappy MPG(our 99 v6 Camry was better). Noisier at highway speeds.
In the end we found a way to get our payments into the affordable on the Legacy, and never really looked back at Pontiac again. The Vibe seems nice, but the new version looks like it has blind spots a mile wide. The G8 sounds terrific, and hopefully they'll keep it around, maybe as a replacement for the Impala*. I guess my final overall thought for Pontiac is that, for my generation(mid 20s to early 30s), Pontiac never really did anything that wasn't done better by another brand.
*: And fer chrissakes, bring that G8 ST over here as an El Camino!
srdha on May 28, 2009 at 11:04 PM
i gust want to say some thing "great job"
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Fragile Stump on August 15, 2009 at 02:06 PM
Why did Pontiac call and keep a car with the name Grand Prix?
pdennis93 on September 06, 2009 at 12:16 PM
I think they should have nixed buick instead. There hasn't been a good buick since the 1987 GN/GNX. As for Pontiac, their best line died in 2002 with the Firebird and Trans Am. I myself own a 95 Trans Am in black and that car is a keeper. I'm pretty sure there will be nothing new like it (the new camaro isn't as exciting as a trans am, and it doesn't have t-tops)